No.961 (GG&GE)

No.961  Gani Ganapathi (India)Georgy Evseev (Russia) JF-LOGO-1

Original Problems, Julia’s Fairies – 2015 (II): July – December

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No.961 by Gani Ganapathi & Georgy Evseev – Take & Make specific echo-mates in Miniature form. Composed after No.440 (by G.Ganapathi). (JV)


Definition:

Take & Make: Having captured, a unit must immediately, as part of its move, play a non-capturing move in imitation of the captured unit from the capture-square. If no such move is available, the capture is illegal. Promotion by capture occurs only when a pawn arrives on the promotion rank as the result of a take&make move. Checks are as in normal chess: after the notional capture of the checked K, the checking unit does not move away from the King’s square.


No.961 Gani Ganapathi & Georgy Evseev India / Russia original – 27.11.2015 After No.440

Solutions: (click to show/hide)
white Kd8 Pc2d2 black Kd5 Qb2 Sb3c3

h#2             b) Kd8→c8           (3+4) Take & Make


15 Responses to No.961 (GG&GE)

  1. Luce Sebastien says:

    Dear Gani, Georgy,
    your problem remember me a problem of mine
    published in Phenix with PWC added :
    White : Kd6 Pd4é3
    Black : Kç4 Sé6
    Sébastien LUCE
    Phenix 245 dec 2014 diag 7118
    h‡3 2 solutions (3+2) C+
    Take & Make
    PWC

    1.Sf4 Kd7 2.Kd5 é×f4(é2;Sé3) 3.Sç4 é4‡
    1.Sç5 d×ç5(d3;Sd4)+ 2.Kç3 é×d4(ç2;Sé3) 3.Kd4 ç3‡
    Best
    Sebastien

  2. GanapathiGanapathi says:

    Dear Julia,
    I notice that on clicking for Solutions, nothing appears!
    Anything wrong with my computer?

  3. Paul Rãican says:

    If some moves could be replaced with orthodox ones, then these fairy moves don’t justify. The following version demonstrates that d2xc3->d5 is replaced with d4-d5
    Pieces
    White Kd8 Pd4 Pc2
    Black Pb7 Kd5 Sb3 Qb2
    h#2 Take&Make 3 solutions

    1.Sb3-d2 Kd8-d7 2.Sd2-e4 c2-c4 #
    1.Kd5-c6 c2*b3-c5 2.Qb2-b5 d4-d5 #
    1.Kd5-d6 d4-d5 2.Qb2-e5 c2*b3-c5 #

  4. Seetharamanseetharaman says:

    The mates work only because of T&M. Therefore one can as well use T&M moves.

  5. Kostas Prentos says:

    Speaking generally, what Paul means is that an effect, or a move, that uses a fairy condition in order to enhance the impression, when it is possible to do without, is not fully justified. As such, it can be replaced with a non fairy specific move, without losing any of its value. I am not referring to this original problem, or to Paul’s version, because I haven’t analyzed either of them.

    Looking at the WCCT theme for the fairy section, I realized that it is very easy for a composer to fall into the trap of adding extra material that is not really justified, only for the effect of adding one more thematic move to the content of the problem. Keeping this in mind, I expect the fairy section of the WCCT to be very interesting.

    • Because of the traps galore, the theme of WCCT G is difficult to compose for, in view of inevitably very much differing views of judges. When the theme was announced, I though the theme is bad. Many months of composing have not changed my view on it. Well, the result might surprise, but I would bet against any positive surprise.

  6. GanapathiGanapathi says:

    Dear Raican, Juraj,
    Pl. tell me if the following version also suffers from the same drawback:-
    W Kd8 Pa3d2 B Kc5 Qb2 Sc3 Bb4 (3+4) H#2 T&M
    Sol:-
    a) 1.Kc5-d6 d2:c3>d5 2.Qb2-e5 a3:b4>c5#
    b) Kd8>c8 1.Kc5-c6 a3:b4>c5 2.Qb2-b5 d2:c3>d5#
    (Of course, not WCCT G theme)

  7. GanapathiGanapathi says:

    Dear Raican,Juraj
    I have further arrived at another version as follows:-
    W Pa5d4 B Kc7 Qb4 Bb6 Sc5 (2+4) H#2 T&M NoWk 2 Sol:-
    1.Kd8 d4:c5>d7 2.Qe7 a5:b6>c7#
    1.Kc8 a5:b6>c7 2.Qb7 d4:c5>d7#
    In this setup, White cant mate by orthodox P moves!
    Is it ok now?

    • Dear Gani, I have been playing with various possibilities and I like the most the following:

      Stipulation h#2.5
      Condition Take&MakeChess
      White Kh7 Pb2 Pe2
      Black Rg8 Kd5 Sc3 Sd3 Qc2
      2.1.1.1.1

      1…Kh7*g8-d8 2.Kd5-d6 b2*c3-d5 3.Qc2-c5 e2*d3-e5 #
      1…Kh7*g8-e8 2.Kd5-e6 e2*d3-e5 3.Qc2-f5 b2*c3-d5 #

      It avoids twinning and seems to make the captures useful.

  8. Paul Rãican says:

    And if you like three phases:
    Stipulation h#3
    Condition Take&MakeChess C+
    White Kf5 Pb2 Pe2
    Black Kd5 Sc3 Sd3 Qc2 Bh5
    b)Bh5→a1 c) + bRd1

    a)1.Bh5-g6 + Kf5*g6-e8 2.Kd5-e6 e2*d3-e5 3.Qc2-f5 b2*c3-d5 #
    b)1.Kd5-d6 b2*c3-d5 2.Ba1-f6 Kf5*f6-d8 3.Qc2-c5 e2*d3-e5 #
    c)1.Bh5-g4 + Kf5*g4-c8 2.Kd5-c6 e2*d3-c5 3.Rd1-d5 b2*c3-b5 #

  9. GanapathiGanapathi says:

    Dear Juraj,
    Your version of my joint 961 is an improvement as the twinning is neatly avoided. But it is still supposed to suffer from Paul Raican’s criticism.
    As for me, I am inclined to vote for Seetharaman’s view that since the final mates are T&M, the earlier moves of White can also be T&M specific!
    I would like to have the comments of Georgy Evseev also.

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